Vegetas new Form?

Salagir explicitly said that Gohan is still stronger than Goku and Vegeta, as well as that Goku and Vegeta would never be able to become as strong as Gohan was. He also said that it would be impossible for Gohan to get stronger than he was after Elder Kai's boost. So yeah, that's pretty much flying in the face of the whole "limitless potential of the saiyans" thing. He also says that SSJ transformations won't just keep going up, that it is impossible for humans to match Super Saiyans, and that Android 18 is stronger than base Vegeta, and that neither Goku nor Vegeta are anywhere near as strong as Buu Saga Vegetto.

What does this mean for DBM? Actually, not a whole lot. Gohan isn't fighting in the tournament, so he's not going to come into direct conflict with Goku or Vegeta. He didn't train, so of course he isn't stronger than he was before. It's a tournament, so character's are not going to have time to increase their strength outside of zenkais, fusions, and absorbtions. We've already heard Salagir's stance on SSJ4, and have seen that Goku is still at SSJ3. We didn't really expect humans to match the super saiyans. If Vegeta or Goku fight android 17 or 18, they'll just go SSJ before they take them out. It's the same with Freeza, Bojack, and anyone else they had to go SSJ to defeat. Vegetto is still way stronger than Goku and Vegeta. Bra may be stronger than Goku and Vegeta, but she's in the other side of the bracket, so she won't even be a factor until very late in the game. Gotenks will be stronger than Goku and Vegeta, but that's not really that surprising. And that's pretty much it.

sorry but if that is salagirs stance he is an idiot.

there is no way in hell that in 20 years, goku and vegeta did not surpass gohan. they constantly train. gohan does not.

it almost seems like he doesn't care about u18. and just wants to make it a mary sue power level fest between, vegetto, broly, buu, gohan and bra.

yay!

any new ideas on this?

Docter KillJoy wrote:sorry but if that is salagirs stance he is an idiot.

there is no way in hell that in 20 years, goku and vegeta did not surpass gohan. they constantly train. gohan does not.

it almost seems like he doesn't care about u18. and just wants to make it a mary sue power level fest between, vegetto, broly, buu, gohan and bra.

I love you :)

Maybe now you'll finally catch onto the fact that salagir is a desperate famwhore admitting whatever his short fused mind can imagine will be passable and maintain the flow of attention he so pissfully desires....

killjoy - then stop reading the comic? and btw bra is nowhere near a mary sue. for the last fucking time.

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:killjoy - then stop reading the comic? and btw bra is nowhere near a mary sue. for the last fucking time.

keep telling yourself that.

People hate Bra, Mary Sue = Everyone loves that person and doesnt hate. Obviously the Bra from the other dimension doesnt like her. (Selfhate anyone?)

they hate her because they think shes a mary sue. when she possesses only one or two mary sue traits. 1. really strong. 2. child of main character.

Really strong doesn't apply as a Mary sue trait in DBZ...she gets to keep it though, because even by DBZ standards she's ungodly strong.

Child of a main character doesn't apply in a progression type martial arts story. A story that goes on long enough will see the main characters having kids, and as Bra exists in one Universe already, some variation of her is going to exist in the Vegeto universe. The only flaw with it being that she looks the exact same. Bulma's genes must be ungodly potent.

anyhow, when assigning Mary Sue traits, you have to keep the context of the story in mind.

Let's stop arguing about whether or not Bra is a Mary Sue and get back to the topic. I think Vegeta's going to focus on speed and endurance.

Hyp3rB14d3 wrote:Let's stop arguing about whether or not Bra is a Mary Sue and get back to the topic. I think Vegeta's going to focus on speed and endurance.

does sound interesting, he ain't the dbz punchin bag for nothing

Leon wrote:His base isn't that much stronger than Goku.

It is a -little- stronger though. I don't remember when it takes place, but theres a spar between Vegeta / Goku in the novel at SSj2, and Vegeta is slowly winning.

So Vegeta's base is probably 3-5% stronger.

This bothers me though, how could Vegeta be even "a little" stronger than Goku at base? Especially in accordance to Salagir's own rules. When Goku was training at home (which we can safely assume he did a lot prior to uub's arrival) he was most likely training at base and not mastering SS3, with Chi-chi around. In fact Goku was training in base prior to the Androids arrival too, but all of a sudden totally he abdicates this training when he tries to master SS3 to the point were Vegeta can catch up (who is also 10 years older BTW)? If Salagir actually pays attention to his own rules it would most likely mean Vegeta achieved his new power by some outside source. Not necessarily by the elder kai or namek of course.

Maybe Korin's mystic water?

I think the reason Vegeta caught up is because Goku temporarily put his training on the back burner to help Uub catch up to him.

Hyp3rB14d3 wrote:I think the reason Vegeta caught up is because Goku temporarily put his training on the back burner to help Uub catch up to him.

That's still not very plausible because Vegeta became "even older" by the time Uub arrived (his sixties to be exact). Besides, if he was trying to help Uub keep up thats all the more reason to train his base form.

Edit: He was in his 50s when Uub came and he's in his 60s now.

Ah, but while Goku has been teaching Uub to fly, how to control his ki, and basically to be competent when he's not completely running on rage, Vegeta's been doing gravity training. It's more a difference of the intensity of the training than the amount of it.

Hyp3rB14d3 wrote:Ah, but while Goku has been teaching Uub to fly, how to control his ki, and basically to be competent when he's not completely running on rage, Vegeta's been doing gravity training. It's more a difference of the intensity of the training than the amount of it.

Gohan was able to train Videl (who had very little potential to speak of) within a few weeks (maybe a few days) in all those areas you listed and don't even get me started with Gohan and Piccolo. Also there is such a thing as over training, which is why Goku didn't use his second time in the hyperbolic time chamber.

salagir seems to forget his own rules a lot lately though

Docter KillJoy wrote:salagir seems to forget his own rules a lot lately though

Yeah, so Vegeta probably did "work really hard" and find a way to become more powerful (if even slightly) than Goku in there base and pre-SS3 forms.

other account wrote:

Docter KillJoy wrote:salagir seems to forget his own rules a lot lately though

Yeah, so Vegeta probably did "work really hard" and find a way to become more powerful (if even slightly) than Goku in there base and pre-SS3 forms.

at least he forgets them for u16